16Bit TF FO Challenge Rankings
After the very first Face-Off Challenge, 16Bit TF has compiled a ranking system to indicate the promotion/relegation system as well as give players a clear overview of who scored exactly what.
Pro Bracket Results
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Novice Bracket Results
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New Brackets for Face-Off Challenge 2 (Provisional)
LgN get’s promoted to Pro Bracket and Fags/Naked get’s relegated.
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The second Face –Off Challenge will be held on the 6th of November at 19:00 in the same manner as the first and seedings and details will be posted as soon as possible. For these to be finalized Fags and Naked will be obligated to play a tie-breaker match as they are currently tied for 3rd place in the Pro Bracket. This tie-breaker must be played by Monday the 17th of October or a constructive decision will be taken by administration, the team with the least cooperation will be relegated.
Teams will have till the 17th of October to confirm their participation in the next Face-Off Challenge, please note that line-ups are not locked until the 30th of October, to which teams will have the opportunity to secure players.
Teams who do not confirm participation in the next cup or at least request reservation (1 week extension only) will automatically be retired after the 17th of October to open up spots for new teams.
Please note that any one may not apply for an extension on confirming participation, teams may only do so should they have an absence of manager/captain or have a serious issue that can not be avoided. Requests may be sent to 16bittf@gmail.com.
An announcement will also be made as to how many spots have cleared for new teams in the Novice Bracket, should teams retire from the Pro Bracket. Novice Bracket teams will be promoted.
Introduction of the Beginners Bracket
The Face-Off Challenge will now be open to 12 teams, allowing us to introduce yet another bracket for beginner teams; we would like to urge the community to keep the teams new and not just old novice or pro players reforming new teams.
Important: 16Bit TF would also like to urge all teams who had participated to re-enter the second cup, it can be assured that seedings will not be so tough and teams will not be playing the same teams they have in the first round than in the first Face-Off Challenge.
And with that I (Lolita) would like to thank every one’s participation, support and assistance in making these tournaments possible. In particular I would like to thank Kradenko and Xt3rminator for allowing us to use the IS Gaming servers and assisting in setting them up. I truly hope to see this ranking tournament go somewhere, I will certainly be running it throughout next year and aim to bring some prizes to the game, I will work with the teams who are willing to progress and be constructive to this community and give it all I have.
rsa.tf – Twitch Channel
TF2CSA – Facebook Group
TF2CSA Steam Group
TF2SA Pugs
Thanks a lot for all of your hard work, looking forward to the next comp!
I just want to offer my opinion here…
I really think that at this stage a ranking / point system is completely irrelevant and pointless considering we only have 4 teams in each division / bracket. We should instead focusing on playing these one night cups more frequently with more teams first, and once we’re at a stage where we have ideally 5 or 6 teams per bracket, then introduce the point system.
The main priority right now in my opinion is to get the player base up and get more teams, and I feel with such small brackets relegating and promoting teams is not fair, since quite clearly naked/fags is a tier 1 team but they lose 1 game and they get demoted? Likewise LgN only had to win 2 games (with very strong substitutions they will most likely not have next time around) to be promoted, and I feel this strongly imbalances the ‘divisions’ and will demotivate both these teams.
Don’t get me wrong, I applaud the ideas and the work being put in, I just think the organizers need to rethink the timing and structure for the time being until we’ve had a few more cups that include more teams, with the addition of a beginners bracket, just to get the numbers. I believe in the long run this will be much better for all the teams and the competitive scene in general.
Yea, I agree with Goldfox. Surely we should this, but just not atm.
I have to agree with Goldie here on pretty much his whole post. Idea is right, timing might be off.
hey guys 🙂 I understand what you are saying and you aren’t wrong, I’ll explain why I had decided to do the points system and promotion/relegation.
Firstly I feel like having a promotion/relegation system is the means of having a controlled environment for teams to get exposure to other teams they otherwise might never get to play against, withholding them from critical experience in my opinion to better as a team, this depending completely of course on how much the team cares to progress or grow.
Secondly I would like this to encourage teams to rather stay together than just reform other teams, it is my goal to secure prizes for these cups, which I’d rather award to consistency in a team that has stuck together and played continuously, gathering points, than to a fly-by-night team that swoops in and takes a win.
The timing of it all is a difficult thing to plan, but, there is no time like the present and if not now, when? at least we are dipping into some kind of league structure to prepare the community for what might lie ahead in the future and also trying to protect lower tier teams from getting discouraged completely, however I am aware of the Legion game, so please don’t bring that up, should CyB log a dispute the team will be placed under investigation.
I am still relatively new to hosting TF2 comps and still make some small mistakes, I value every one’s input and try and learn from it, so thank you for the feedback and taking the time to voice your opinion 🙂
Good song that 😛
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kF3nUgSk6Bc
Tf2 comp community needs to try something different, so far Lolita has shown that her ideas work, so I’m willing to at least give this my best shot before I decide it’s not gonna work, and if it doesnt work, we make changes and try again 🙂
A huge problem in our community has been that teams don’t stick together. If someone has a better idea that would suit more with the ‘timing’ pls share. This is not written in stone, it’s a proposal on the way forward.
The idea is great however is not something new for those who can remember back in May 2010 http://tf2.co.za/news/tf2csa-team-rankings-its-up/ I started a similar system (http://tf2.co.za/rankings/) which had same goals of course.
However if anyone is interested about knowing the reasons for the rankings been stopped I would gladly tell you :). And back then we had over 12 teams they were good times is just a pitty that our competitive community was hit by some drama as usual….
Also just remember 😛 teams don’t want to play the same opponents time and time again, promotion/relegation gives some diversity in match-ups 🙂
Knockout cup’s and friendly’s will still happen where lower tier teams can try put up a challenge vs higher seeds to measure their real performance. Teams want to play with realistic opportunities at competitions but to implement successfully the promotion and relegation system we need to make sure we consider the skill leves at TF2 gameplay where it can have up to 5 levels and when we have such a small community the gaps can be very big.
I would recommend you to do a play-off between the team that is going to drop vs the one to be promoted until we have enough teams and divisions to make the auto promotion and relegation without the play-off match.
Teams also don’t want to play 10 minute matches. I know lower tier teams need to play higher tier teams at some stage to improve skill bla bla bla, but it can be a bit pointless at times.
I fully agree with Gold, at this stage we should just work on teams participating. I know there are a lot of new teams crawling around on the pubs.
Great idea. Grow then go.
Although I’d rathar say, lower tier #1 vs upper tier #4. Winner go/stay in upper tier.
I guess what razer said :/
haha quick summary though
My question is just this, if not now, when? When will this community ever slip into a more professional underpant? 😛
There are many things to address, no one said they couldn’t be done at the same time, I wonder what the bad effects are atm when it’s not even come into play yet.
Opening a third bracket serves the purpose of making space for more teams to form, giving things a chance instead of not being open minded about it is the way to try and improve.
The promotion/relegation system was included in the announcement post about the Face-Off Challenge, I wonder why people only now start to think about it and comment on it, it’s not even gone into a phase where you have results and facts to base opinions on, why just dismiss it as not fitting for the time when you haven’t even seen what it can do 🙂
Give me a solution that is viable, has been proven to work and I will surely look at it, promotion/relegation has done wonders for teams in all sorts of games, it can take a team from being tier 4 to 1 in a year’s time, I’ve seen it, experienced it and trained enough squads and players to achieve exactly that, there will ALWAYS be a skills gap, in all game types and fields, it’s not likely to be bridged in 3 or 4 months, everything takes time, I’m not saying that this system will make things better like instant pudding, but given enough time, it might just surprise you guys 🙂
Let’s say CyB makes a minor adjustment to their line up, practices every week and improves substantially, so much so that they completely steam roll all teams in the Novice Bracket, surely they deserve a chance to compete in the Pro Bracket?
If we encourage teams to do just enough to stay where they are, how will they get better?
Addressing Play-Offs:
It is a good idea and should the community be willing to nip off one more Sunday night a month, we can implement it from Face-Off Challenge 3 onwards, these play-offs will be held the Sunday after the initial cup, between rank 4 Pro and Rank 1 Novice, as well as Rank 4 Novice and Rank 1 Beginners SHOULD THE BEGINNERS BRACKET FILL. I suggest we have a poll and let the community give some feedback about the idea, personally, I think it’s brilliant, thanx Razerfox 😉
To be able to understand the future and plan for it, you must know the past…
There are no doubts that the promotion/relegation system is what we really need but there are reasons that have kept us stuck without long term teams and leagues to apply it.
Ask the community and you’ll find out.
TBH then I was not the one running the comps 😛
Teams change, line-ups change, people change/grow up and something can be built on with a fresh start, do not linger in your past, it’ll bring down the future 😉
Fair enough…
If I remeber correctly it was mention before and the promotion/relegation.
CYB are more than willing to playing the “PRO” bracket when ever. just play in it. we have 8 teams if we lucky. You dont see the English Premiership split United, Chelsea and City into a “PRO” Primiership division coz they better than the other teams.
This community has always suffered because people cant take loosing and emo out. I have played this game for a long time and have seen it. Most of the time its a lack teamwork thn actual player skill. There are players playing in the lower div that have and can play on “pro” teams.
I’m sorry I just dont see the point in having 2 divisions of 4 teams…..Over the last couple of months I have only played Masters, fags, nkd all in my Div. How are we helping the lower teams? (coz tbh honest most of the time we only play when there is a cup, the rest of it is pugs)
I agree there should be a beginners division, but it should have a cut off of X amount of clan matches. other than that every1 should be in one division. Its up to you as a team and individual to improve. We all started by getting beaten.
Would be awesome if we had 20 teams then I could see the point. This is just my opinion. Still going to play either way.
^_^ i still value your input.
It’s difficult in a small community, but I believe we can make something great out of it.
Well we’ll all give it a good old colege try!
thanks for all your effort, it is appreciated!
good reply…I agree, know pcZ are no strangers to getting smacked around (evil eyes at CyB), but all you do is pick-up the pieces and keep at it. I know we dont mind one division…heck, we just wanna play TF2!!!
(know this comment prob contributes zilch overall…but I dont care ;P )
Zephon, you guys have been true pioneers 🙂 and for that sir, I thank you!
You have great sportsmanship and determination and give us some hope that there are great teams across all divisions that can be worked with and that love the game ^_^
Zephon, you never seem to dissappoint in making me laugh haha yeah we have probably lost more than any team in SA at this stage, and yet, we do still enjoy it, we work hard, sometimes not like we should, but atleast we enjoy it, even after losing! 🙂 thanx bro. Really need more positive and happy people like u in this community. (just from a teammates perspective, haha 🙂
Also if any one missed this:
Lolita says:
October 11, 2011 at 12:48 pm (UTC 2 ) | Edit comment
Ok Guys, this is really important.
After reviewing the finals of the Novice Bracket (CyB vs LgN) and securing a screenshot, a decision has been made about this match.
It has been found that LgN used 3 subs which is not within the 2 sub rule and therefore LgN and CyB will be posed with the following decisions.
Option 1: CyB agrees to replay the finals against LgN where-in LgN uses no more than 2 subs that are NOT from a tier 1 team. (It is preferable that LgN plays their original line-up that they registered with.)
Option 2: CyB refuses a rematch and LgN forfeits the finals or LgN refuses a rematch and forfeits the finals.
Should these teams select to play a rematch the match will have to be played before Monday the 17th of October, and both teams are obligated to report results on the initial match thread supplied by TF2.co.za.
You are to secure your own server for the match.
NB Notice: It is YOUR responsibility as a team to refuse to play matches where your opponents are breaking rules, if you carry on playing the game further actions will not be taken in future.
If you have a query, complaint or dispute it is YOUR responsibility to email it to 16bittf@gmail.com or the dispute WILL NOT be taken into consideration.
LgN and CyB will have a rematch on Monday.
Just to clarify and emphasize what I was saying; it’s not the idea of this ranking and relegation/promotion system that I am questioning, it’s the state of the community at this point in time when you want to implement it.
“If not now, then when?” – Like I said, when we have more teams. More teams will also make it more successful overall and give it a better chance of sticking, since as razerfox said, a rankings system has failed twice before because of pretty much the same reason.
I really feel that what is needed to address this is more frequent comps.
Why not make the “Face-off Challenge” an every weekend event? Additionally we could try combining the 2 divs into 1 division of 8 and having a beginners bracket open to any other team as a kind of an entry point into comps, which will hopefully encouraging new teams to be formed and some of the “pub teams’ to enter.
If we were to use this as a weekly event to get the ball rolling and force more games to be played more frequently, we could THEN start a proper league in the near future once with point rankings and relegation / promotion where we would hopefully have more teams to fill a 2nd bracket and keep 8 teams in the 1st.
Again, a weekly event would then allow for the different level teams to face each other on a regular basis without having such negative consequences such a div1 team being relegated for losing just ONE game, and then having to wait such a long time to try earn promotion again.
How abt we give this a go, if it doesn’t work, we rethink it and try again.
Personally I don’t like the 1 division concept. PcZ gets +9000 for their attitudes, but growing 3rd division requires that we have comps with more than 1 division.
I like the relegation system because it promotes teams sticking together, it raises the std, it moves us towards comps where we can have leagues, it enables teams to have the opportunity to play vs better teams, it promotes the teams that have been sticking together and working on improving their game etc etc. I also don’t mind the fact the we atm have only 8 teams, means we can run a tight ship, test this out, improve on mistakes and be ready for increase.
We are all on the same side here, we love playing TF2, let’s make this work. 🙂
I don’t think anyone is against promotion and relegation system, all we need is teams that stick together for the long run and that’s it.
So we can either wait for that to happen (like we have been waiting for long time), or we can implement a system that promotes that.
What does the team captains say?
If you take some time to ask players that have taken part on TF2CSA compts all this time you will find out that the brake up and make up of clans has been excessive. And that’s why we have been without a solid system. I’ve been chasing that idea since October 2009 http://tf2.co.za/news/pre-season-divisions/ and those who have been involved with the community since then will tell you the same story.
I think people are getting a bit confused with the whole ranking, system and so on.
What we are discussing here are rankings for 16Bit TF tournaments. This is not for TF2CSA Leagues where the teams usually get seeded based on their latest performance and the players on them because we never had the chance to have a stable group of teams.
16Bit TF One Night Cups have been helping us a lot to build up teams as it’s a competition that happens every month and therefore teams hang around waiting for it. It is giving us consistency but some teams are not seeing the long term plan of it. These cups with knockouts might not be so encouraging for lower tier teams but it will get better as soon as we get more teams.
If you remember why TF2CSA League V3 was canceled I can remind you that after our dramatic end of the DO Gaming Cup finals just cracked our great momentum after managing to get 16 teams sign up for it. We basically are starting from scratch after those incidents that left our community like a dead town. 16Bit TF One Night Cup have giving us some life and I’m sure we can keep building up for next year’s leagues. TF2CSA will be back with 2 leagues a year with prizes and if we keep up with over 16 teams other doors will open up.
Let’s work together and we shall move forward with a solid team base.
ROFL!!!! Lolita is sparta mamma
Take a nap.
LADDER SYSTEM IS THE WAY TO GO!!!!!
ONE LADDER SYSTEM BEING PLAYED THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE YEAR OPEN CHALLENGES ETC……
WITH 1 NIGHT CUPS/1WEEK CUPS EVERY NOW AND AGAIN WITH SEEDING BASED ON THE LADDER AND/OR PREVIOUS CUP RESULTS.
Cap attack over. Read, and react….
I had a ladder before but it was not ELO based (http://www.ladder.tf2.co.za/ladder.php?ladderid=1). I could try again to get a proper one and give it a shot.
But I really would like to have that match challenging system open through all the year hey thanks for the feedback mate 🙂 I will re-think the options to improve it.
If u ever wanna talk more about it, various features we could include, i’d be happy to help out.
I played competitive CS in the UK at the time the ladder systems were very popular (EnemyDown, Clanbase, etc) so think i might possible maybe have a few ideas to share.
Let’s talk mate I really would like to get a proper ladder going on not just for teams but 1v1 stuff as well. So we got an all-in-one challenging system for each and everyone. Snipers 1v1, Soldiers 1v1, etc with the help of MGE mod and then teams we can have 6v6 and 9v9 for highlander.
bball ladder 🙂 2v2 3v3 etc :DDDD
Oh and btw, as long as we are having any comps, it is GOOD for the community.
Thanks for all your guys work so far. Keep improving, would love us to be in the DGL soon, those guys are growing sooo quick we need to try and jump on that wagon.
very true. I agree. As long as we play, no matter the outcome (winners, losers etc), THAT is progress for the community as a whole.
TF2 has got such huge opportunity now. Valve has given us an awesome platform to grow on, lets make the most of it.
P.S I WNT EDIT BUTON PLOX
Done! Users now are able to edit their comments 🙂
Geno is a wise man.
So give him his edit button!!!!
P.S valid points.
Just would like to thanx all the people that are involved with organizing and stuff. I know u guys want to make this community grow and I really give it to you guys/gals…I can not even imagine the amount of work and input it takes. So thank you!!